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| Posted: Mon Sep 21st, 2009 08:00 pm |
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61st Post |
| Posted: Mon Sep 21st, 2009 10:48 pm |
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62nd Post |
MoneyGuy
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WFGsucks, I see I have a PM from you but for some reason my PMing is disabled. I don't want to post my business email address here and don't have a throw-away (hotmail, etc.) email address. If you do, would you post it here and I'll email you. If not, I suppose I can set up a hotmail address and post it here. I don't know how else to contact you. I don't know why my PM is disabled. I'll try sending a PM to see if sending works.
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| Posted: Mon Sep 21st, 2009 11:25 pm |
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63rd Post |
wfgsucks
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Ya it looks like I can see your messages. You can send me an email at ray689@hotmail.com.
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| Posted: Tue Sep 22nd, 2009 01:35 am |
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64th Post |
Admin
Administrator
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Sorry MoneyGuy my fault. Your PM is now active.
Steve
TALKCalgary.com
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| Posted: Tue Sep 22nd, 2009 03:41 am |
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65th Post |
| Posted: Sat Sep 26th, 2009 03:31 pm |
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66th Post |
| Posted: Sat Sep 26th, 2009 06:06 pm |
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67th Post |
MoneyGuy
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Pfft. I knew you were with WFG when I read your first sentence.
Many people here will know Primerica better. WFG is Primerica on steroids. As for insurance licensing, those CE requirements are the same as what everyone has to meet. You cite the Investment Executive ratings? Ha, good one. Of course WFG and Primerica rate well. Reps of both firms always give very glowing reports on their companies because their ability to recruit is enhanced. If anyone wants a real review of firms like this, talk to a respectable advisor with a respectable firm for their impressions of either of these companies. It won't be good. I have friends at many different firms and generally have nothing bad to say about these companies, but I have nothing good to say about these MLM flakes. Sorry, you're selling but I'm not buying. Another poster called a WFG person a junior liar; sounds about right to me.
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| Posted: Sat Sep 26th, 2009 10:23 pm |
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68th Post |
wfgsucks
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Okay cowgirl, obviously you're a WFG agent. So I hate to break this to you, but Investment advisor rankings are based on what agent say and when you have thousands of morons recruited and brainwashed, of course they're going to rank high. Do some research for your own good. Look at the old Hubert Humphrey days and the WMA days and the lawsuits and the illegal activity. Ask why you're top agent for the last 5 years from California is now facing legal action. Look that stuff up. Save your self. It is not possible for you to become on of the top people. The average WMA agent and things haven't changed since then, made 20.83 per month. If thats financial freedom then you continue chasing the dream. Read this article:
http://www.fourwinds10.com/siterun_data/business/corporate_fraud/news.php?q=1224542089
Here is a little bit of it:
What A.L. Williams did with term insurance and the “buy term and invest the difference” sales concept, Hubert Humphrey would do the same with VULs. With the business format system that he had perfected in his prior company, Mr. Humphrey would take the VUL industry by storm. In a ten-year run from 1991 through 2001, WMA would hire more than 400,000 recruits, sell over $4 billion in total sales, and pay out to their sales associates over $1 billion in commissions. During this period, WMA produced approximately 700 distributors who earned more than $100,000 per year, i.e, those who have made it financially and can quit their 8-to-5 job.
WMA’s success ratio is about 0.18 percent (700 divided by 400,000) or less than a quarter of one percent, and it paid out on average $250 per year per recruit ($1,000,000,000 divided by 400,000 divided by 10 years) or $20.83 per month per recruit. Hardly numbers to sell the dream to new recruits. But was WMA a cash cow for the preferred provider companies.
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| Posted: Tue Jan 19th, 2010 02:18 pm |
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69th Post |
CGYJNKRMVL
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As a small business owner I got it too a few years back when I made the mistake of joining the PGIB (pathetic group for incompetent businesspeople) this one guy in the group representing WFG blew a whole bunch of sunshine up my a$$ about how great it is to be in the garbage business. blah blah blah, then they wanted signup fees for seminars and that sorta thing... I shut him down point blank... Man, do these people have nothing better to do? Like get a 3AM infomercial and offer a free slap chop with your signup fees or something... surely people that reply to infomercials are the kind of losers they wish we all were.
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| Posted: Mon Jan 25th, 2010 04:52 pm |
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70th Post |
financeguy
Guest Member
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Yes WFG and Primerica had similar roots, but WFG is hardly Primerica on Steroids. I used to think WFG was a scam, but I got all of the information I needed first hand and I am a customer of theirs. WFG Canada has an amazing line of all Canadian Product providers, many of whom actually go to WFG to customize products to suit their clients (I'm able to make $100 deposits into Clarington funds that require 75,000 min deposit from non WFG clients). That's says alot. WFG is a NEW company in Canada (12 years), so it is easy to bash them after a few new agents do the wrong thing. If you read Ric Edelmans book "The Lies about Money" you will be absolutely shocked at the DOCUMENTED cases of fraud and misrepresentation by the worlds best known companies and banks (have a look at the middle section..he highlights these pages in dark grey for a reason!). It is easy for us to dismiss these charges because these other companies are so much older and established. Some of us quickly conclude that in many cases it was the COMPANY that was the victim of the agent's wrongdoing becasue they are so well established. Why then are we so quick to blame the WFG company when the same thing happens (even though it occured on a much smaller scale)? Established" is a relative term thesedays, just have a look at what banks are doing to the middle class behind the scenes (look at the google video Money as Debt part 1 and part 2) as well as how many are beginning to fail..especially in the US.
Actually, Ric Edelman is now gaining immese popularity and respect about his ideas regarding using your home for leveraging. If done properly, you will gain wealth and security. Guess what, 5% of wealthy Canadians share 95% of all of the wealth and that is no coincidence. Many of them (not all) use their homes as wealth building tools becasue someone showed them exactly how to do so. WFG agents can do this and do it well, but ONLY for those that want it. The part that might really make mad about the 5% wealthy Canadians is that they learn how get a TAX REFUND for their mortgage payments from Revenue Canada. All legal techniques and designed for the weallthy. WFG is very knowledgeable about these little known techniques.
WFG has an actul mission statement/crusade and is out there to help the middle class. They EMPOWER the middle class with education, where the lack lack therof has been a major profit tool for other institutions who depend on poorly financially educated middle class citizens for their success. Now, many banks are coming to WFG becasue they are either afraid of the good things they do or just want to get on board early. Now the Mortgage Center (CIBC) and RBC disability insurance are on board with WFG among many others. WFG has already created a definate polarization effect in Canada. There are those who will really hate them (ie: competitors who feel threatened by the empowerment WFG offers the middle class) and those who love them (clients who have been successful as well as the many agents who are also clients themselves).
Your best bet? Get ALL of the information. Call up the many product providers and ask them. Ask a client, etc. Do not depend on the huge bathroom wall called "google" to do your research.
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| Posted: Mon Jan 25th, 2010 05:12 pm |
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71st Post |
wfgsucks
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Well Finance guy, I appreciate the fact that you do your research but just so you know, I am a former WFG agent and I am not a competitor so I am not being biased when I say this, however you are wrong in some of the things you say. The wealthy don't get a tax deduction on their MORTGAGE payment because that is not legal in Canada. You are getting a tax deduction on the money you invest out of your home equity so to say that they show people to deduct their mortgage is a little misrepresenting on their part. And you're right, the wealthy do use leverage and you can get wealthy doing it, however it isn't for everyone as WFG would like you to think. Also they are investing in much more secure and effective products. And just so you know...80-90% of those wealthy people became that way from property and real-estate. Please find me one person who became a millionaire from owning a WFG style product.
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| Posted: Mon Jan 25th, 2010 05:42 pm |
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72nd Post |
financeguy
Guest Member
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Yes you are correct that should have read "you get a deduction for all or part of your mortgage INTEREST payment" so I apologize for that. That is 100% legal in Canada, and many of the wealthy use an interest only payment making the whole payment tax deductible. Read the book "the Smith Manouver" for more info.
WFG is very wise in explaining to middle income Canadians how the wealthy think. Many middle income Canadians have nowhere to begin (like myself), so they use the home equity and WFG techniqies as a place to start. Because WFG showed me how to remove bad debt and shoot my score to over 800, I am now able to borrow funds while I'm deveoping a multi-family property that I will sell (this part is my own plan not WFG). This is IN ADDITION to all the WFG techniqies I am using. You see without WFG i had no place to begin and no bank would ever look at me. Now I have net worth (and the bank loves the value of my UL as part of that) , so I took the next step. WFG started me off on this path. Without them I would still be in a run down apartment complaining about why I can't get ahead. My first million is possible in the not too distant future, but that's because I choose to earn it. Of course this is not for everyone, but WFG uses a great know your client process before even recommending any techniqies to clients. Some people are conservative while others just want to get ahead, that's why WFG has soo many providers. Perhaps things have improved since you were with them? Perhaps your office wasn't fully trained as yet?
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| Posted: Mon Jan 25th, 2010 05:49 pm |
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73rd Post |
wfgsucks
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They do push UL on everyone and that doesn't work for all either. The method you speak of about using your home equity isn't anything new and many financial firm will show you how to do that when it is something right for you. And in your case I can tell it is because you seem like a sharp person and have used the methods to invest in something that will make you money. This is not the case for the majority of their clients, especially the ones who may have used their home equity to dump into a large UL which is totally wrong in my opinion and I'm sure many financial advisors would agree.
Its too much of a cookie cutter approach and that is my issue with it. But good luck to you in your property endeavors because I believe if you continue doing what you are doing you will achieve your goals. I currently work for a property investment firm and I have seen it happen to people first hand. If you want to discuss that side of things by all means you can send me a private message.
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| Posted: Mon Jan 25th, 2010 06:39 pm |
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74th Post |
financeguy
Guest Member
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Sure I'll PM you to see what that is all about. I used to think UL was the wrong product until I learned how it worked and used it myself (and how my lender liked to see it!). It's a complex product but WFG gave me the education to use it properly. It is a great product for those who have a hard time disciplining themselves to invest monthly (that was me at first). I have since gotten so used to my monthly UL payment I have forgotten about it.
Of course, normally you would not leverage your entire home equity into a UL (maybe a small amount to begin generating returns), it is just a part of a complete tax advanted family plan. WFG uses UL, RRSP, TFSA, Leverage, tax efficiency, good debt and education as part of a complete plan.
WFG actually does not push UL on everyone (they have tons of term product) if it is not right for them. UL is actually the best product in Canada for its tax advantages, and WFG uses them in addition to TFSA (about 11 years ago when UL first came out the wealthy were overfunding their UL to get lots of tax free returns, but Revenue Canada soon put limits on that!).
Look at this scenario: The cost of insurance gets paid with pretax dollars earned within the UL policy return itself. For example, if you were paying $100/month for a 30 yr term product, you would have to earn upwards of $150 at your job to get that $100 in hand after taxes, etc. With UL the return could give you that $100 before tax to pay the full cost or most of the cost of insurance (basically, you didn't even pay for the insurance cost!). You then take the $100 you would have spent on term and reinvest it somewhere (put it back in the UL if you are not disciplined enough to keep from spending it). On top of this, when you go to take out your money from the UL as a monthnly income payment you use a bank to take out a policy loan (loans are not taxable in Canada) that gets paid back when you die, so in essence you get your money out of there tax free (no wonder lenders love to see UL!!). On top of all of that you have coverage for life not 30 years. There is a great book by Ben Baldwin called :The New Insurance Investment Advisor" that explains this in great detail. It is an American book, but the concept is exactly the same and I'm sure a Canadian version is in the works as we speak.
WFG advisors are awesome at teaching you about this product. Do you see why WFG empowers people? Its all about education. Money, taxes, UL, etc are complicated and WFG offers education to those who want it. The government would not even allow UL if if was so bad. It is highly represented in the government exams agents must pass, so that must tell you something.
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wfgsucks
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Well you sure proved everyone wrong by posting a link to "their" website. How come nobody else thought of that?
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rolo512
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I've been following this topic and I find the debates to be very thoughtful guys,
However, there is of course always two sides to a coin. Writing as an average joe (with a BSc degree) who have just had "first contact" by a WFG representative. I find their idea of business to be somewhat interesting.
Correct me if I am wrong, at a more personal level, the cost of going into this self-employment WFG business is ONLY(emphasized) approximately $500.00 in liquid asset- for application, courses, books, license, police check, and probably a small list of random names and contacts that I have to provide them, correct?
The way I look at it is that, considering a course in University costs around $600.00 in Canada, am I unjustifiably wrong to approach the WFG application/experience as taking a course in University? My line of reasoning is that, at the end, the minimal cost for application yields knowledge in business and personal finance/investment that I've never had before. Plus, I get to go to their weekly trainings for free, right? So in the long run, am I not only paying $500.00, and am benefiting from a whole line of trainings and education?
-----------------------------------
Question: several people did mention that there are Hidden Fees (ie. monthly fees- something called C&O fees). Can someone confirm with certainty the validity of this fee? (Any insider knows?)
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wfgsucks
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Well I can see where you are coming from with your comparison that its cheaper thats a University course, however, you are not dealing with people's lives and finances when taking a University course. And also you are not losing credibility with you friends and family and having them ignore your calls because you are trying to "hire" them into some scheme (which it is) i might add. Just do some research to find out where the top leaders actually make their money. Its not from this great business they run, its from charging all their agents for conventions/trips and so on. Trust me, I was there so I know all the ins and outs and thats why I left.
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rolo512
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wfgsucks, thanks for the response, now I have a much better feel of what's going on.
So basically the whole problem with this company revolves around "unethical and immoral issues" that will likely transform me into an unethical person (more or less) if I wanted to make big bucks in this company right?
But do I possibly have to go that route?
Also, when you were in the company, couldn't I just sell the services (Match-up and personal sales) to achieve and sustain income? Is it mandatory that I kill and slaughter every relationship I know?
And returning to my original question, do you know if there are any hidden fees?
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wfgsucks
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Rolo512, I totally understand where you are coming from . The issue with them is if you just want to be a personal producer then you will be very hard pressed to make a good living. As a licensed associate you are at a 28% contract level (that is 28% of 84% of the commissions paid to the field because wfg takes the first 16% as administration costs). This is the second lowest commission structure in the industry behind primerica (which is the company that all the top reps used to be with before WMA which is now WFG). Now they will say they have the best commission structure but thats based on recruiting to become a marketing director. Thats the top contract and its 67% of that 84% percent i spoke of earlier. If you want to do personal production you can start at many other firms that will pay you 70% of 100% (that is key) to start, meaning you will not need to recruit and ruin any relationships. And to be honest you will learn much more if you pick the right firm. And depending on where you live, I can give you a list of the firms that many ex WFG reps have gone to and done very well.
Now as far as hidden costs, yes there are many. You will have to pay a monthly fee for your email and website use. And also there are many trips and training that you will be attending that you will have to pay for (registration fees, travel and hotels.) They have these quarterly and NEVER train about products rather focus on recruiting. And lastly, the trips that you "win" for being the best, well you actually have to pay for those too.
Remember, all the training they ever do is about recruiting and never about financial services and how to do better for your clients. They will always say "get the list" because you are helping those people. The reason they say get the list is because many reps don't stick around and they want to make sure they have their contacts. Even if you try the business and then realize its not for you, they will still contact your list and try to recruit them saying thats what you wanted before you left because it just wasn't the right time for you or something like that. Everyone I know who has left has become much more successful then they were at WFG. The people still at WFG will tell you that those people are failures and gave up on their families. But I'll be honest with you, I was the top personal producer in my office for 2 years in a row not crack $35,000 per year. I have all the plagues and awards if you would like proof.
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rolo512
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Thank you for you always speedy replies wtfsucks. I'll reconsider and do "additional" research before I step forward this time, I am simply seeking for another sword to duel wield with (my BSc degree in psychology being my first blade).
Completely assuming all your suggestions are valid - since i am not completely clear with the contract level percentage system you mentioned - and that I am to work in a legit and ethical manner; it appears that I'll need to work the extra mile to achieve the same success as compared to other firms. All the hidden costs you mentioned seems unreasonable also.
I'll bring up a complete set of questions to my friend during the next scheduled appointments at WFG.
If you have any suggestions, please feel free and enlighten me a bit more 
By the ways, I live in Toronto, and company suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
Thank you for your time.
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wfgsucks
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It's good to hear that you will make sure to do the right research. Let me just tell you this, I got into the business to educate myself and to help people. At the time WFG made me think thats what I would be doing but I learned over time that I was actually making things more difficult for people because many were joining and believing that they would become wealthy in this industry. The unfortunate reality is that the industry isn't for everyone as they would like people to believe. The high income claims are not true. And also...they do say that you will need an average of 100 AMA's (meaning recruits) to get to the top contract level of MD (marketing director). Many people don't want to recruit those kinds of numbers.
I will try to get a list of other firms for you very soon. And as far as the questions you bring up in the next meeting, please be advised that the answers you receive may have a spin on them or your questions may be brushed off. I actually fly out to Toronto about once a month on business and if you really like I can answer any questions you have regarding both the mutual fund industry, WFG, other firms, or the exempt market products industry which i feel is much more effective for clients. Let me know and I can make time for you. And please don't take that as a way of me trying to recruit you to any other firm. My career now involves me overseeing financial firms who deal with exempt products and I train them. I am in no way a recruiter but i can still help. And i am only offering that because I want to make sure that people don't have to go through what I did for a couple of years and almost ruin my career and credit due to all the expenses i incurred and I know many other with WFG do. Let me know if you want more information, otherwise take care and I wish you all the best in your career.
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oilerfan
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I'll been reading this thread throughout the whole day. Have considered the opinions of the pro-WFG and Anti-WFG persons, having read a few of the articles posted, I am beginning to think that this company has some good information and can be valuable to people(assuming their financial conditions are right) but is not a company worth working for.
I had been approached by a WFG rep and have seen the presentation, talked to a QMD(was beginning to buy in), and have paid the $125 AMA fee.
What my plan is, so far, is to take the course($265) that teaches the new recruits the methods used by the company to optimize the use of money(the leveraging, debt reduction, saving methods, etc.) for educational purposes.
My question is to "wfgsucks":
Will taking this course provide me with a fairly good education of how all these different types of accounts work(HELOCs, Open investments, etc) and the various ways I can use these accounts to save/invest efficiently? Is it worth taking???
Keep in mind that:
1. I am finishing up my degree in school(am 24 yrs old)
2. Will be entering workplace soon(starting career)
3. Don't really know too much about all these financial services
4. Am under the impression that taking this course will hopefully result in me making good decisions with my money(aka future money, am still poor student)
Am looking forward to your reply and I thank you for your time.
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rolo512
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oilerfan,
Firstly, I am not really writing to answer the questions cause I didn't take the courses. I have several suggestions though.
I am writing simply because I am on the exact same boat academically with you (23 yrs myself graduating this June)- plus I also see similarity in our lack of insurance/financial background. So please don't mind me for my comments.
After speaking with wtfsucks from the last couple of posts and consulting several relatives and friends who worked at primerica, Amway, and several MLM firms in Canada; I can be sure to tell you that the short-run initial cost is minimal, but the long-run investment (money you give them) will be a whole lot.
The one example they keep on giving me during the talk is that "Why only have one bullet in your gun, when you can have two bullets in it as backup? What if your first bullet missed the target, then you're dead meat?"
But let me ask you, what about professionalism? Are we going to put our 4-5 years of university education to a waste? I haven't even finished constructing my first bullet, and I'm making my second one already... so even if I have a machine gun, it'll always be shooting blanks and not killing the target. (hope you understand my illustration. lol)
The point to keep in mind is, the representatives are initially biased, and the presentations are meant to hype you up for their business scheme, their trainings will seem educational and beneficial; however, we're not specialized in insurance/mutual funds.
I totally understand where you're coming from, the training can be used for personal education; however, as soon as they ask you to pay more, step out of it.
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wfgsucks
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Hello oilerfan,
Sorry for the late response but I just read your post today. When you're asking about the course and whether it will help you in the future, the answer to that is not really. The course is a government course so its mostly theory and never about application. I'm not saying it won't help at all but as far as applying anything yourself that is usually learned on the job in the industry. Which is another reason why I don't think WFG is the place to do that. Their techniques mostly focus on recruiting and only slightly on the financial services aspect of the business. There were agents in the office I was at who had been there much longer than me and did not really know what they were doing when it came to putting together a proper plan for clients. This scared me because these people were dealing with people lives and retirements. And as for the other response to your post, I totally agree. The presentations are hype because they do need to continue the hiring flow in order to keep the business running. Also the initial minimum cost seems reasonable but you are in for a big surprise if you go forward with them. The last year I was there my costs were over 20,000 because of trips/conventions/trainings/hotel/etc. And the funny thing is, all of these were exactly the same (to try to hype people up). They were all exactly the same. And a professional firm would not have Thunderstruck blasting while people who know nothing about the industry are spending their hard earned money to go there (while some are dancing on table while their personal lives are going down the drain). To refer to your analogy....this won't add any bullets to your gun, and in-fact, you might have to sell your gun to pay your bills. I was very close to ruining everything in my life because of the belief in the company. They have a very good way of making people stick it out. (almost a brainwashing). Guys I just want to make sure you are very careful with what you get yourself into. And one last thing, DO NOT give your list to the MD in the office. You will regret if you decide to leave, and even if you stay. The biggest thing they say at those conventions is when you hire someone "GET THE LIST". They spin it as though you are helping them because they don't know what is good for their family. However, its really so there are more names for them to contact because chances are the new recruit will leave.
YOu guys can contact me anytime you want and I can give you further details. Remember, no matter what you are told, this isn't me just being vengeful or anything like that. I have a great career now and make more money than I even need, while helping people just like I wanted to. I just want to make sure people dont make the same mistakes I did and ruin any credibility they have with their network of friends and family. I still have people who will not talk to me and its sad but thats the case.
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oilerfan
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Thanks a bunch for your inputs rolo and wfgsucks.
Everything I was being told seemed too good to be true... and of course it ends up being just that. The more I looked into WFG, the more shaky my confidence was becoming in the whole operation.
Again thanks alot for the honest advice. Blantant honestly about this company seemed pretty hard to come by.
Lastly, if one was interested in finding out about all the various vehicles in which you can put your money into and how you can make it work for you, where/how would you go about doing that?
Or is the best thing to do, go to a pro financial planner at a bank or something and go about it that way???
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| Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 01:56 am |
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87th Post |
izsanni
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could someone tell me how I could best handle WFG? A friend of mine came to beg I do the kids RESP with WFG, I innocently started the education savings plan (under heritage plan). Now I want to reduce the monthly contribution and the WFG is writing that I will have to lose the $5,000 I have contributed so far as membership fee. This is a Govt product that is administered free in the Bank. I need advice pls.
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| Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 01:58 am |
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88th Post |
izsanni
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could someone tell me how I could best handle WFG? A friend of mine came to beg I do the kids RESP with WFG, I innocently started the education savings plan (under heritage plan). Now I want to reduce the monthly contribution and the WFG is writing that I will have to lose the $5,000 I have contributed so far as membership fee. This is a Govt product that is administered free in the Bank. I need advice pls.
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| Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 04:01 am |
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89th Post |
wfgsucks
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Hey oilerfan,
Just got your post about where to go for that advice. If you are in Calgary or Edmonton, I can put you in touch with some industry contacts I have there. These are successful people who are very educated in the industry and will be able to guide you with whatever you would like to learn. If you're interested send me a personal message and I give you some contact information for myself and anyone else who may be able to help out. Oh and just so you know, I'm not saying that to gain a client or anything like that. My job is actually a financial firm representative for the products that my company offers. So my job is to actually train partner firms who offer these products. Take care and I look forward to hearing from you.
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| Posted: Mon Mar 15th, 2010 01:28 am |
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90th Post |
cowgirl
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First of all I'm humbled by my WFG experience in that it took me 3 almost 4 years to understand what exactly it was. If you read my past posts...I did everything I was supposed too and believed. Now don't get me wrong.."some" of the products that WFG markets for the product providers are great...however some of the people and the concept of recruiting...not so great.
I resigned from WFG in November ; yes I did spend alot of money to become licensed and attended conferences and training. At the end of the day I still did not feel that the information I had was enough to say I was a Financial Planner and do plans for families. Yes like I said I agree that some of the concepts they promote work..takes discipline ..I am grateful for the education I received on these concepts. The office fees you have to pay ..the fees for this & the fees for that...well in 3 years I can tell you I earned nothing. And yes to those of you that support WFG it did take me 2 years to get licensed as I was working full time & it took me 4 attempts to pass my provincial...but my trainer promised me a referral fee for referring people to him when I wasn't licensed...my trainer was a friend before WFG...I built my team and my new trainees were told the same..(trainers are not supposed to offer referral $ I found out later) needless to say none of us were paid. The total for each of us was over $1000.00.
My trainer was full time, I wasn't so the MD said we have to help the people that have made the full time commitment first..and once you are full time you will get the same. They tell you to associate with the successful people ..sure thats ok but are you supposed to forget about your "friends" along the way. Does friendship now become if you are in WFG we are friends..if you are getting recruits and bringing in business for me..we are friends.. Well I learned a hard lesson on friendship.
Integrity and Friendship are huge for me and the lesson that I learned through all of this is that WFG steals peoples Integrity and ruins friendships.
I guess you can buy new friends...the WFG way...
Recently a girl I know in Calgary got a call from someone at WFG re: a job. I told her ask questions..if they are offering you a job you have to pay for..don't do it.
When i got involved I knew it was a business opportunity it wasn't presented to me as a job..but a chance to make a difference in my life & others . I like that..I do NOT like having to recruit to make it...
Yes the mission statement is no family left behind..and I still do have some positives that I take with me from WFG..the "BASIC" information/education I received helped..I know more now about HELOC, RRSP's & Life Insurance.
However I am humbled at myself for having to eat my words on what I initially thought and realized that unless I recruited anyone & everyone...I would not make it in the WFG world...and ya know what...I'm ok with that...today !
Last edited on Mon Mar 15th, 2010 01:29 am by cowgirl
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| Posted: Mon Mar 15th, 2010 01:45 am |
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91st Post |
cowgirl
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To WFG Sucks...
I walked the same path as you...I tried it....I'm not as good as expressing my thoughts & experiences as you but I can tell you this..
You are telling it 100% like it is in the WFG world.
Thanks for your posts..hopefully we can help those that really want the information to think twice before they drink the WFG kool-aid like I did..
I truly thought I was doing a good thing...but turns out...I was wrong
I am alot happier now that I am WFG-free
(and more in debt with the HELOC and Investment Loan..and etc , etc)
There were lots of fees..sure I was able to claim most of them on my taxes but still I will not recruit..that is 100% MLM !!!
Thanks again for your great & HONEST feedback..
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| Posted: Fri Apr 16th, 2010 07:23 pm |
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92nd Post |
scamh8er
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scamfreetown wrote: I met a girl at a club that does sports and fun stuff, she said that she was a “financial advisor” and she asked me if I wanted to visit her at work and see what she does. I went and there was a meeting or some sorts of a lecture where everyone was dressed well and had fake smiles just like the fake money they BRAGGED about. I had no idea what was going on but I tried to believe that girl because she looked trustable, then I talked with one of the marketing directors.
The lecture was about how you could make so much money and how advancement was so prominent in this business.
World Financial Group is bunch of liars who don’t want to work and use people to make money from nothing.
They wanted me to pay $125 for a background check, I mean what multi billion dollar company has to get there prospective employees to pay for a back ground check, and can't you get those from the police for free. Then they wanted $275 to get my license and a book.
They did everything perfectly, too perfectly. It was with no doubt a cult where everyone believes that they are making $250,000 and nobody can wipe the smile off their faces long enough to find out different.
WFG is a joke don't deal with them and don't become an occult practice yourself it won't get you anywhere. All what they were after is your money and phone book to call your friends and do the same with them. In case you missed the thread on Primerica, they are basically the same maybe worse.
I’m Happy to say that I recognized this scam but that cost me $125 of the money that I worked hard for.
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| Posted: Fri Apr 16th, 2010 07:30 pm |
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93rd Post |
scamh8er
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reading this for the first time made me feel like i posted it myself since I had the same experience right down to the smallest detail only it wasn't some girl I met in a bar but someone who recruited me from the workplace I agree they really suck big time, I lost my $125 but hey that's a pretty small price to pay to see a person's true color, guys there's something to be thankful here at least we didn't become instruments for these ruthless liars in scamming even more people like our close friends and families, see that's why they were so obsessed in diving into our contacts and phone books
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| Posted: Sun Apr 25th, 2010 03:15 am |
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94th Post |
BA
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Would you agree that no matter where you go there people you trust and people you don't? World Financial Group, like the military, or any other corporation are no different - they are a cross-section of North American society (GOOD & BAD). Do you label the whole corporation of just the person? World Financial Group has been around in Canada for nine years, 25 years in the States. It is here to stay. What do they do? They teach common sense financial strategies that the rich have known for decades to the masses. They connect those who wish to use the products offerred by companies like Franklin Templeton, Equitable Life, TD Bank, RBC, Manulife, IA Clarington, Transmerica Life etc., to those companies. If you went into TD and asked for a loan to invest in IA Clarington or Franklin Templeton, do you think they would talk to you? Do you think any one company has all the best investment opportunities that fit everyone's needs? Because World Financial Group deals with the entire financial industry, they have no stake in where your money goes. They can place it where it does what you want. They are only supposed to sell to those that want to buy or recruit those that want to join. Everyone has the right to say No. "No I don't want to save money". "No I don't want to work hard discovering what families need to make my living." Just say "no thank you" without getting so negative and bitter. Personally I think if you want to do your research, talk to the companies that deal with World Financial Group. Some of these companies have spent alot of money checking out World Financial Group and have staked their reputation on dealling with them. Some of these companies have been around for 50 or even 125 years and they believe in what World Financial Group is trying to accomplish. I would be glad to give anyone the phone numbers or websites to help them do that research. Any questions, just ask...nicely.
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| Posted: Sun Apr 25th, 2010 05:31 am |
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95th Post |
scamh8er
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......just read what people have to say about WFG on this discussion board. Both (ex) insiders and other victims.
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| Posted: Mon Apr 26th, 2010 01:03 am |
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96th Post |
BA
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Errors & Omission Insurance Fees (E&O) are an industry standard for all Life Insurance licensed representatives that is regulated both provincially and federally to protect the client, the agent and the company. The same is true for the License. These are the same no matter what company you represent in the Insurance Industry. World Financial Group mentors individuals in acheiving the licensing standard, they are mandated to have in place. As with the rest of the industry, compliance is mandatory for consumer protection. E & O is like Malpractice insurance for Doctors. The cost of the license is usually handled at a college that has a contract with World Financial Group and the provincial government. The Associate Membership agreement is $125 and it goes to giving the individual access to corporate e-mail, financial assessment tools, weekly training by those successful in the business as well as from the product providers, discounts on training seminar from people like Tom Hopkins (world renoun salesmanship guru), Les Hewitt (author of Power of Focus) and many other guest speakers as well as a dedicated team of product provider contracts and assistance. Everything you need to succeed, except the drive and belief that you can, is provided. There is an infrastructure that is set up just to make sure that agents can focus on helping families without the headache of runniing the business by yourself. World Financial Group is not just a job. It is an opportunity to build a business for yourself based on helping people, without going into the kind of debt you would with a franchise.
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| Posted: Mon Apr 26th, 2010 01:29 am |
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97th Post |
BA
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From what I've read on this site, the negative ex-insiders and victums are the ones that either failed at the business or failed to get their questions answered. Because they have failed they are spending their time blaming instead of accepting responsibility for their own lack of understanding. Instead of pointing fingers, ask questions. Get answers and accept the consequenses of your own decisions. The industry dictates that you cannot be paid until you are licensed. That rule has nothing to do with World Financial Group. With a license and World Financial Group strategies, training and support, you can make good money in the financial services industry whether you recruit or not. Whose decision is it to spend anything more then the membership agreement and licensing fees? The individual. In fact, if the opportunity doesn't suit you, whose decision is it to do more then use the strategies for your own finances? This site seems to be full of people that are afraid to face their own part in their own failures and are set on blaming others for their decisions. World Financial Group is a great business opportunity for the right PERSON. Their concepts and strategies due to their alliances with multiple industry giants make them the ideal place for anyone that wants to improve their own finances. Not everything is for everyone! If it wasn't for you, get over it. At least you didn't make the same mistake buying a franchise in which you would have spent tens of thousands of dollars to get into.
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| Posted: Mon Apr 26th, 2010 02:00 am |
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98th Post |
BA
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it is illegal for banks to offer anything other then GICs & mutual funds in their branches. Their returns right now are less then inflation. If you want to guarentee a loss due to tax & inflation, go ahead and use the bank. You will also need to speak to an insurance representative or possibly an independant financial planner to get a complete plan. Financial Planners are usually fee based so you'll need money to make money. Unless you have alot of money, banks won't spend much time with you either. They certainly won't educate you on how money works. That's not their mandate. The Banks' mandate is to make money for their shareholders, not the individual. World Financial Group has the connections to do everything - just look for an agent with more experience. I work with one that has six designations in the financial industry and 26 years experience. He had his own successful financial business and brought his clientelle to World Financial Group because of concepts, strategies and industry contracts. This individual is headhunted by all the industry giants and won't leave World Financial Group because he can do more for people within their structure then he can do anywhere else. World Financial Group agents charge nothing to sit down and educate families on how money works. It's like the old saying, "give someone a fish and they'll eat for a day, teach them to fish and they can eat for a lifetime". Sit down, talk to them, learn and ask alot of questions. Say No to the recruiting if that is what you want.
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Green Summary
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Finally, I got some useful information to answer my questions toward WFG, but it's kinda late - I paid $125 already. I admit that i am greedy, so I've ripped off.
Again, should think about it - "Money wouldn't grow in the tree."
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scamh8er
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Well these guys are good at it aren't they? And their argument is you put in this amount of money and if you didn't do any work (for them) you shouldn't be expecting anything to happen. Well that's just exactly what you'll get for $125, "NOTHING!"
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Green Summary
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Strongly agree! I am in the situation that I've paid them $125. (very unwillingly) However, I am not gonna paid even a penny more to them.
After hearing two presentations, I found that I was even more confused. I don't know what are they doing over there. They just keep saying money grows so easy, even easier than if you buy the lottery.
I still believe education should take in universities or colleges, not those unknown organization.
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scamh8er
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Consider yourself lucky and wise for losing just $125 to these crooks, just imagine how these guys will suck you dry if you hadn't realized they're nothing bust a bunch of bogus impostors whose motto is "money for nothing"
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Green Summary
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Today I attended to the group training - just want to tell them my schedule has been fully booked till i finished my CGA program. It might take another couple years... I am making an excuse.
Actually, I don't mind to go to their presentation as long as it is free and i have time, but i was told to paid another $50 for books in the next training. What do they mean? They said the training is so good, and those presentations are wonderful; however, they ask you to bring more friends to attend next presentation... I doubt there will be sites left in a "WONDERFUL PRESENTATION".
Maybe I can earn "BIG" money as they metioned after i get my licence, but how long i will get the licence? how much work i have to spend to achieve it. I don't know. It don't sound easy as they described. I don't think i can manage my job, two courses and this. I might just fail to do everything after all...
Therefore, when they said another $50 for books, i told them i felt stress out. I need to postpone the training.
One thing i found interesting in WFG is that most of the ppl in training are not knowing what's actually going on. They might be just pretending as i did, or they were attracted by the "MONEY SAYING". That makes me think of "1984".
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BA
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You have alot of good questions. The course is an industry standard, set up to pass the Life License Qualification Program Exam with the Provincial Insurance Council. It is a basic introduction to what insurance and insured investments are about. Concepts and strategies that World Financial Group uses are taught in field training based on the needs of clients. You should be doing both the field training and the course at the same time to get the maximium educational benefit. Some of the concepts are also taught in free classes. Ask your mentor all your questions and if they dont know the answers they should be able to get them for you. You are free to ask anyone at the office for help at any time. Maybe you should finish your formal education at the same time as learning from World Financial Group. The two dont have to be exclusive. The costs for the course has just been lowered as well so there is less of a risk for a new person. Ask whomever you are talking to at the company. If you arent happy with their answers, ask someone else. Human beings have a tendency to fill in the blanks with information that sounds right whether the information is true or not. Ive read alot of half truths on this site and to the unexperienced, can be very misleading in either direction. World Financial Group is neither a scam or a golden goose. It is a company that is trying to revelutionize the way people are served in the financial industry. People filter all experiences through what they know. It just seems natural to be critical of anything different. Those in the industry already, dont want to acknowledge that there is a portion of the population that need what World Financial Group offers (because they dont understand it). We live in a society that has suffered financially and as such are natrually skeptical. What do you expect to find at World Financial Group
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BA
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I understand your statement about college and university...that is what our experience and society has taught us for generations. College and University courses are great at teaching theory - what government and banks want you to know. They don't teach outside of that structure. I have met alot of what I phrase as "educated stupid". They are so full of theory and have no clue how to apply it. Where is the common sence? Think of World Fiancial Group as teaching how to apply the theory. The ideal situation would be to have both, wouldn't it?
If you want to know what that $125 is really for, it is an administrative fee to connect you to trails, commissions, over-rides, renewals, stock options, training, any recruits you may attract, the computer network, head office infrastructure, personal business you do with clients, product partner resources (contracts with close to 40 companies), on-line supply ordering systems and both on-line & office training, etc. World Financial Group is an international company, (in Canada for 12 years, in the States much longer and now in China for 2 years). Our parent company, Aegon is located in The Netherlands. There has to be a way to track what you do so that you get paid. You only see the benefit of the $125 administrative fee if you decide to do something with the company, like work. They have done their part by connecting you to all the tools and resources you need to succeed (evident by your WFG code), it is up to you to use the tools. Every year the tools get better. "You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink". The ones that refuse to drink are the ones that are the most critical on the web!
Many companies have a fee for coming on board. I worked with a security company as one of my first jobs back in the early 1980s . My first paycheck was docked over $200 for a uniform. Same goes with a deposit on an appartment. If you wreak the place or even just leave it a mess, you loose the money. Have you ever rented a car? Your credit card is taken and if you get a speeding ticket, a flat tire or fail to refill the tank or return it late, your deposit is kept or you are charge more aren't you?
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scamh8er
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Amazing how much connection with basic financial institutions can be established by WFG for such a small amount of $125. My question is, how come WFG cannot establish a connection with the most reputable business institutions themselves, say for example "THE BETTER BUSINESS BUREAU"
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me11ss
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You ppl make me laugh. Is it laziness, or what? Are you one of those ppl that doesn't have the ability to analyze
a situation or opportunity for themselves? I'd hate to see you grocery shopping! 'OMG, look at the fat content! Are they trying to kill me?!?!? Why didn't they tell me that info on the FRONT of the box!' Then you shoot off your mouth to everyone around you, taking the whole situation and twisting it with your ignorance and volatility.
You haven't a clue, do you? It is funny how quickly and easily some ppl jump to conclusions.
I can almost tell you could never do this,
because you are too bitter and aren't
willing to put in hard work to build a better
life for yourself, and others. Were you
promised a Ferrari? Well you shouldn't have
been, because that isn't a very likely
goal. To be financially independent
and show you how to use your money
more wisely? That is what we do. GET
YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT. Are there loose
cannons? FOR SURE! In every industry there
are loudmouths and blowhards! Get all of
the facts...ie. you usually have to read a book
from cover to cover to find out what the
story is about. Funny you are jumping to
conclusions about WFG....
It is something like giving a review of a McLaren F-1...it can get you there quicker and more comfortably, but at first glance you don't like the color of the car or the person driving it. WFG is the vehicle that we drive to help ppl's financial siuations...if you don't know anything about it, don't knock it. You encountered someone who was less than thorough...there are ppl like that in every aspect of life.
The banker sure didn't mind letting me pay through the nose year after year, paying compound interest day after day, month after month, year after year.
The insurance agent didn't mind selling me a policy that gave my wife less than 3 years' worth of peace of mind if I died...
My mind is at ease now...I have the coverage I need and my future monetary needs are being worked on...now I've decided that I want to show ppl how they can get out of the traditional sinkholes and get back on their feet...
My family now have some breathing room and are able to do some renos and not worry about how we are going to pay for our kid's college education...
Keep on letting the banks and the insurance companies short-change you, that's your decision.
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me11ss
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ONE WORD: IF YOU EXPECT TO PAY A BIT OF MONEY AND NOT DO ANY WORK, THAT IS CALLED LAZY! Sorry, in this industry, you getting rewarded for your efforts, nothing else. Nothing is handed to you.
Keep going to college, or university. There no guarantee of a job when you get out. You just paid thousands of dollars for what? Talk about spending money for nothing!! Good luck with the student loans...
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bigfoot
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I need to talk to you about WFG, world financial god or world family group, a sofisticated bussiness cult. I am unable to PM you.
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